Freestyle model inspired by the old big superheavy round vault doors :)

RiemannHypothesis

Hey folks!

Since February i am working on a round vault door model completely made of steel. The door with frame weights about 300kg and the door itself about 120kg, and its diameter is 34cm. Im looking forward to build a remote combination viewer to which i have still many questions.

I mainly used a lathe, a big drillpress and a big indexing head for the door. Some things, like the outer door plate and the crane hinge i have had plasma cutted out of a big 35mm steel plate.

Well, there is still much work to do; the inner door frame is still missing, but raw material is already bought and the whole locking system is under construction.

Here are some pictures 🙂

Best regards!

Maik

Huw Eastwood

Hi again, it’ll get a lot more people seeing it on here Maik- it’s in the best place.

wow again! Now I can see where the 300 kilos is, with that diameter and thickness door plus the frame steels 35mm thick, that’s amazing. You mentioned using stainless steel but to be honest the bright steel you’ve used looks better I think. Stainless steel is so much tougher to turn it’d take a lot longer to machine the same parts, and in some ways looks a bit too perfect as it retains its brightness and doesn’t dull much with age. Plus, like you say the cost would be ridiculous when you’re dealing with large sizes like you’ve had to use there.

You mentioned in your introductory post that you like chunky hinges and made them oversize, I’m the same liking the ‘chunky’ look to these doors, and i think the hinges look spot on, they blend in beautifully with the overall appearance.

I think the remote combo viewers might be the hardest of the different types to find detailed info on, but I think there are some detailed technical plans floating around on here and I’m sure that members in the USA will be able to help if you get stuck. I bet you can’t wait to get back working on it. Beautiful work and keep us updated!

RiemannHypothesis

Hey thanks again for your kind words on my work! Its really good to hear, that it is good looking 🙂
You might be right about the steel, and you are definitely right about machining stainless steel 🙂

Yea the remote combination viewer is a really interesting part! I would love to build one on my own! The material is already here and maybe i can build a simpler one for the beginning… But i have a feeling that the only complicated thing is the combination lock that is integrated there. I have no clue how that corresponds to the parts behind the door frame… But it would definitely add some 30 kilos more to the door frame 🙂

There is plenty of work still to do. The bolts dont work yet and are currently disassembled, for some works that have to be done. I will add some more detailed pictures of how this thing really works.

About a combination lock: I already built nearly all parts of it, and it is scaled down (the notched wheels are 12mm in diameter), and all parts are made of brass and are fitted then in a round aluminium body that will sit in the center of the door (as you can see in the picture above).

Since it is a freestyled door, and because of the massive parts on it, i couldnt built a pressure bar system for it unfortunately. But even with that, the door wouldnt become watertight or airtight, because there are many boundaries on building those doors. And also there are many things i still dont understand regarding the vault doors.

Best regards,

Maik

VaultDoors

I have a keen interest in remote combination viewer vaults. Check out Vault Door Anatomy, it has all the information I could find on remote combination viewers and is available in these formats:

PowerPoint Show (images, active links, animations and videos): https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/…t_Anatomy.ppsx
Windows Media Video (images and animations): https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/…lt_Anatomy.wmv
PDF (images and active links): https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/…lt_Anatomy.pdf
Flickr (images only): https://www.flickr.com/photos/canton…7639842164566/

Also, take a look at the Vault Doors online gallery as it contains all known remote combination viewer vaults: https://www.flickr.com/photos/canton…7639183617364/

I am not a locksmith/vault technician (just a vaultophile) but I would be happy to share my research and help answer any questions you may have.

RiemannHypothesis

Hey guys 🙂

@[deleted]: I checked out your links, but they dont work 🙁 Maybe you posted the wrong destination?

I just wanted to add some more pictures which include the building process and the status quo 🙂

Some words to my machines:

Im using a Liebert&Gürtler lathe from 1957 with a width of 1m and max. diameter of 36cm (max. 50cm if you take out the bridge). The lathe weights about 1.2 tons, and i also have a milling attachement for it, to actually do some milling work.
Moreover i have a G. Wischeroop drill press (about 100 years old) that weights half a ton and can drill holes in stainless steel up to 40mm and cut threads up to M33×3 (that means big 😃 ). I have a thread cutting attachement for this drill press and that makes this machine extremely versatile. I also use a big dividing head to make the holes for the bolts of my vault door, or other sorts of circular arranged series of holes in metal or wood. In my actual vault door i have 15 bolts installed with a diameter of 28.7mm and the holes are 29mm. Because i dont have a borehead to get a real smooth finish inside the holes, the 0.3mm play remain. Currently its not possible for me to reduce that amount of play… A 29mm reamor would have done the job, but i didnt get any…

So you see, to build a vault door out of steel, heavy equipment is needed 🙂 You find some video material of the construction process of the vault door on youtube. Check out:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TuI4Lthv-LU&index=10&list=PLvXbO9SQD-8X-TJNHzRrJMMomz-DDBwPM
where the holes for the bolts are getting bored. Or in this one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ajrxdNMeBw&index=1&list=PLvXbO9SQD-8X-TJNHzRrJMMomz-DDBwPM
where one part of one hinge is getting turned on the lathe. I dont put much effort in editing the videos i make. I just let the camera roll for some hours and load all that stuff just right on youtube. But it is in german anyways so yea… Enjoy the pictures 😃

Well yea so here are some pictures 🙂

Best regards

Maik

Huw Eastwood

Yes I tried the links and found the same- thought it was an iPad problem as some sites have compatibility issues.

well Maik, it’s wow again seeing those beautiful old machines. It’s making me think of the days I briefly had a big old British lathe with 12 inch swing. Didn’t have it for long but seeing yours is making me miss it :=(:

Anyway i I can see why you don’t mess around making small models like I have to, you’ve got some really heavy machinery there and the vault door is the perfect project for them. Your lathe probably weighs more than my workshop…

The vault looks great in the 4 th photo- really shows it off well from that angle 🙁y):

RiemannHypothesis

Heyho 🙂

well yea sometimes there are reasons why we cant have some piece of equipment… Im glad to have it now, but maybe some day i have to quit it? i dont know 🙂
But i saw some of your works and i really have to say that this is very good work! Very detailed and fine! I would love to see more of your works! So you are using aluminium and brass, or steel too?

Well about small models: Its not always a good property to just want the big stuff. My wife can tell you something about that… Of course she likes the vault door, but she would prefer if it would weight a quarter of it… And i understand that 🙂 Im actually glad i didnt make the door even bigger 😃
I think my wife would like your models a bit more than mine, because of their size 🙂 But she understands my desire to build such a heavy door. Thats what i wanted for years, even for over a decade 😃

I saw that you sell your model door from One King West on ebay but i couldnt see how much it was. Could you tell me? And yea, just tell something about your works! Im really interested!

Best regards

Maik

VaultDoors

Sorry about that, the long links got truncated. Try these:

Vault Door Anatomy:
PowerPoint Show - images, active links, animations and videos
Windows Media Video - images and animations
PDF - images and active links
Flickr - images only

Vault Doors - online gallery with all known remote combination viewer vaults

Warren63

RiemannHypothesis wrote
Hey folks!

Since February i am working on a round vault door model completely made of steel. The door with frame weights about 300kg and the door itself about 120kg, and its diameter is 34cm. Im looking forward to build a remote combination viewer to which i have still many questions.

I mainly used a lathe, a big drillpress and a big indexing head for the door. Some things, like the outer door plate and the crane hinge i have had plasma cutted out of a big 35mm steel plate.

Well, there is still much work to do; the inner door frame is still missing, but raw material is already bought and the whole locking system is under construction.

Here are some pictures 🙂

Best regards!

Maik

Loving your work Maik…. loving it.

[unknown]

Doug MacQueen

Very impressive project you have going on there, Maik. On Cleveland Fed door, the timelock is mounted dead center on the door and the combination locks are mounted down close to the floor on the inside of the door frame. One of these days I will get back there to repair the dial knob that was clipped off when making a video of the door. That will require pulling the heavy side cover plate on the remote control viewer, so pictures of the mechanism will be taken. Doug

Doug MacQueen

VaultDoors, you are to be commended for such a good job at compiling this information. And to think all this time I thought you and Wylk were just prepping yourselves for that “one big bank job”. This work should be moved to it’s own thread so it does not get buried here. Doug

RiemannHypothesis

Hey guys 🙂

Thank you for your kind words, im really honored 🙂

@Doug: So that means, the remote combination viewer is connected with the combination lock that is located inside the door near the floor?
Oh yea, please make LOTS of photos, with flash light and without 🙂

@[deleted]: Thanks again for all these informative papers and presentations! I looked it through, but to build a remote combo viewer, more information is needed i think… Pictures of the mechanisms could really reveal some necessary details!

Cheers!

Maik

Doug MacQueen

The locks are not in the door, they are on the inside the vault mounted behind the door frame. That way there are no holes drilled through the door for lock spindles. The boltwork is also operated remotely from the door jamb, so no hole through the door face for bolt work operation. Primarily the idea being to limit nitro from being inserted down into the door.

Adrian Weber

Hey Maik, welcome to the Forum and what a project to start with I have to admit 🙁nerd):

Really interesting and I believe each and everyone here understands your desire 🙁happy):

I believe that you and VaultDoors have a lot in common and should definitely get in touch! If you have any problems in understand his document or any particular vocabulary just let me know and I will translate them to you!

Best wishes from another German fella,

Adrian

RiemannHypothesis

Hey Adrian!

Thanks for the warm welcome 🙂

Yea well, there are many questions regarding the mechanics of that remote combo viewer… I think ill spend some hours in my workshop, because i have a day off 🙂

Im planning (just because its possible…) to build two locking systems: One directly at the door, so the conventional method, with a four-number-combination lock, and the other would be the remote combo lock, also with a four-number-combination lock.

I often see two combination dials on the vault doors: Does that mean, you have to dial two codes with four numbers each?

See you later, guys 🙂

Maik

VaultDoors

Doug MacQueen wrote
VaultDoors, you are to be commended for such a good job at compiling this information. And to think all this time I thought you and Wylk were just prepping yourselves for that “one big bank job”. This work should be moved to it’s own thread so it does not get buried here. Doug

Thanks Doug! Hopefully, I’ll get the chance to visit some of these remote combination viewer vaults. 🙂-:

[unknown]

VaultDoors

RiemannHypothesis wrote
…but to build a remote combo viewer, more information is needed i think… Pictures of the mechanisms could really reveal some necessary details!

You may want to ask one of our Toronto members to stop by One King West to get dimensions on the remote combo viewer. I know you are looking for internal workings but actual measurements will help with proportions.

Have you reviewed US Patent US2081316? It details two remote combo viewers that appear to have been used on the Pennsylvania Treasury vault.

[unknown]

RiemannHypothesis

Hey VaultDoors 🙂

Yes, i checked the papers earlier and they helped a lot to understand the mechanism. I think the only option i have, is to build a simplified version of it. But it will do the job. I already changed design plans on the vault door, so that it actually will get a very nice and massive pressure bar and the only locking mechanism will be the remote one. The real difficulty is the demanded precision for all parts of the door: The hinges have to be perfectly parallel in the xz- and yz-plane. Also the pressure bar has to be parallel to the door surface and to the xy-plane. Otherwise nothing will work… Furthermore the dial indicator has to be very precise, otherwise you will dial the wrong code. I think this will be really tricky 😃

Have a nice day 🙂

VaultDoors

I found a few more pics of the Industrial Trust Bank vault a.k.a. The Superman Building in Rhode Island. The side view shows the bolt actuating pins but there is another pair of smaller pins/buttons above them. Does anyone know what these are?

There Woolworth building vault also has a second set of pins. The bottom pin is connected to the (non-existent) time lock but the top pin does not appear to be connected to anything… There is a smaller diameter pin attached to a locking bolt but it does not appear to be attached to the top (larger diameter) pin on the outside.

Doug MacQueen

It looks like 2 different timelocks were used on that door which would explain the rods that extent that far. The one that doesn’t go anywhere may have been for a bolt detent (holdback) feature.