Hey all, is this key special or common?

forgottendoll

Hello friends! I recently acquired this key have no idea where it originated from, and I know it’s not very old but it seems unusual to me because of the interesting indentations of the shank, I haven’t seen anything like it, but then again I’m a newbie. What do you think it was used for and does it have any value, beside the esthetic one?
Thank you very much!

Pschiffe

Looks like a Bramah key. Joseph Bramah patented this in 1784 in the UK and it was an early “pick proof” tubular mechanism akin to today’s Ace-type vending locks. I’m sure you can find lots more info on the Internet now that you know the proper name. I believe they are still made, in a modern form, to this day.

Pete Schifferli

Billy B Edwards Jr. CML

It is a key for a Bramah lock. These locks and keys are still in production today and have been continuously since their invention in the late 1700’s. I was told some time back that the original bitting list is still being used since the end of it has never been reached.

The mechanism is officially defined as a type of lever tumbler known as a slider and it bears no mechanical relationship to a tubular pin tumbler lock in any way.
BBE.

forgottendoll

Wow, thank you so much! You are great, I am amazed by how quick and well informed your answers were, I really appreciate it! I find it fascinating, how many things you can find just looking at a key (not me, obviously, but I hope someday I’ll be able to do the same)
Off to read the story of my key 🙂
Thank you again 🙂

Scott Klemm

You asked is your key special or common. It is not a typical Bramah key, so I would say it’s special. The bit (the flag-like projection) is untypical for a Bramah key. Not only is it larger, but also has notches like a lever key. I have never seen this particular key type.
Attached is a photo of my small collection of Bramah keys. The smaller keys at the left are what I would call typical Bramah keys. The two larger ones are apparently for safes. Perhaps other readers who specialize in safes can tell both of us more about these larger keys.

thelockcollector

It’s a “Bramah-Chubb” type key. The lock has both sliders and levers. Not particularly rare or special.

Scott Klemm

Yes, it is a Bramah-Chubb key. (I should have checked my reference material more carefully.) It may not meet the definition of rare, but it is not the common variety that most collectors would encounter.

forgottendoll

Thank you, you are so helpful!
Lovely collection, Scott! My Bramah-Chubb key is only 7 cm long. Even if it’s not that rare, I think with the story of the fame that it once had, of being “unpickable”, it’s an interesting piece of history. The sketch excerpt from your reference material is right on!

Can you guys recommend me a book that is the most exhaustive regarding identification of keys, like a dictionary or something? I know there are many books out there but I don’t know which one to start with.
Thank you so much!

Tom Gordon

Bramah type yes, but Chubb have always been a completely different company.

thelockcollector

Tom Gordon wrote
Bramah type yes, but Chubb have always been a completely different company.

A “Bramah-Chubb” type lock has nothing to do with the company that made it. It was a German lock maker that first combined a Bramah mechanism with Chubb style levers.

[unknown]

Scott Klemm

You’re right !!! It was patented in 1881 by Carl Kästner. It had 5 levers and 9 sliders and was for a safe or vault. The patent is DE 20,417. (Maybe somebody can get the actual patent drawings and post it.) I’ve learned a lot researching this key, and you can trace my progress as you read my previous postings.

magpie

Here is an example of a Kastner safe lock.

Doug MacQueen

That is quite a lock! Bolt, latch and hook catch all in one. Can we see inside? Patented in 1816, Robert Kemp combined the Barron lever and Bramah slider idea in what he called the “Union” lock. It doesn’t look like the Bramah with the cut slots in tube wall though. It had internal depth stops. Doug

2buy1

Would love to see the inside as well. I have a very similar lock but was curious how it would be mounted to the boltwork.

forgottendoll

Thanks everyone for all the great info that you’ve posted!