Gougler Keyless Combination Lock Assistence Requested

ElbowMacaroni

Hi there,

I have a Gougler Keyless Locks padlock w/o combo. The shackle has the number 6129 stamped onto it. I know that some people have been able to get the combo from these blind codes on here. If anyone has a reference that has this # listed, it wouldbe greatly appreciated!

Pics as required for such inquiries:

Thanks,
Elbow

wylk

Try this: turn right to zero, and keep going right 4 clicks. Left 8, right 7, left 2, right 4 and pull open.

ElbowMacaroni

Hmmmn… that was a no-go; however, I did feel some points during the dialing where the shackle jumped and/or the dial got a bit hesitant to continue turning. Maybe these are manipulable after all? It would still be nice to have a working combination without having to brute force it.

Oh, and I did try that combination in reverse (transposed the right/left) just for kicks as in some of the other threads regarding these locks, it seems that a handful of people got the combo given to work when run through switching the rights and lefts. That was a non-starter as well, which I pretty much expected, but figured was worth a shot.

wylk

Most of these locks feel “odd” when coming to the end of the last click, and I have one where I have to wiggle the dial back and forth around that last click to convince it to open. These have an interesting cam-and-stylus mechanism but I think if the lock is abused the stylus can get bent. Here is a picture of a partially-cut-away lock:

I’ve never heard of anybody finding a way to manipulate these.

ElbowMacaroni

Very cool on the cutaway showing the “maze” disc. That is quite interesting and not quite exactly what I’d imagined when someone had described the mechanism in another thread. I will keep your suggestions in mind when I try again a bit later. There were some fairly distinct but quite small movements of the shackleand variation of the dial’s rotation action at various points in trying to dial in… I haven’t heard of anyone manipulating one either, but that doesn’t mean it’s impossible, although perhaps it is… at the vrey least it seems unlikely anyway.

Now I need to get some more of these so I can make some cutaways of my own! Maybe with a cutaway a method could be determined to manipulate with much head scratching…heh… Must hunt ebay now…

Thanks!
Elbow

oldbiscuit

Elbow, Just out of curiosity, if you turn the dial left, will it come to a stop? I’ve got several of these Gougler locks and some I have to turn them all the way to the left to stop then start from the stop and count the clicks. And others I have to start from 0. If you have no stop, try turning left a couple of rotations and stop on 0. Then go R4-L8-R7-L2-R4 and see if you can lift the shackle. Mark

oldbiscuit

Elbow here’s a pic of my cutaway Gougler. Thaey really are an interesting lock.

ElbowMacaroni

Hey there OB… I tried it the way you suggested as well and still no joy.. I guess it’s as you told me elsewhere that it is likely one of the 1% or so that the blind code translation is wrong in the code book. Oh and since you aksed, I thoguth I’d trow it out there in case anyone else has any suggestions and so that I can be giving enough info… it is not one of the ones that stops.

I will keep messing with it nonetheless though.

ElbowMacaroni

Hey there…

Okay, so I got 7 more of these off ebay, some with the slot for the key at the bottom. I will be posting pics soon so that I can attempt to get combos for them; however, right now, I was wondering if anyone has a pic of what the keys for the ones with the slot look like.

I’m also trying to devise a method for decoding/manipulating them. I think I might be onto something, but I need to figure out how discern the movement of the stylus in from an outward movement if possible. If I do manage to work that out, I will be posting about it and possibly making a video. So wish me luck on that! But in th meantime a pic of a key would be awesome!

Thanks!
Joe

oldbiscuit

Joe, here is a link to a previous thread with a pic of my lock and my homemade key. The key is inserted and pivots off the end, Mark
http://www.antique-locks.com/showthread.php/2191-Gougler-keyed-combo

ElbowMacaroni

WOW! That is one interesting key!

Thanks Mark!

ElbowMacaroni

Some observations and a question…

Okay as to the possibility of manipulating these to recover the combination; I am certain that is is possible with enough practice. However, I don’t believe that it is something that could be written up and suddenly everyone is getting incredible successes either.

There is a definite feedback via both the shackle and the dial when the stylus moves in or out. There is also a very slight difference in the quality of the feedback as to which direction the stylus moved. Now given that one might think that the difference could be explained, but, the difference is extremely subtle. Given that, I believe that with enough practice and getting very used to the subtle difference in the feedback, one could get to a point where it is more like a muscle memory type thing in detecting which way it moved. So play around with them, I bet that given enough time you’ll get it down. I haven’t gotten it yet perfect, but I can determine the difference about65% of the time, so better than chance, but still not enough for reliability either. Good luck and have fun learning that! Also, I would recommend using a cutaway to verify the direction of movement. This is so far the only case in which I would actually recommend using a cutaway to learn to open a lock. They are very cool, and are great for teaching the concepts of operation, but are not a good learning tool for anything further due to the fact that it causes one to develop a crutch without which on will likly run into difficulty and have to relearn to operate only via feel.

Now, the question… Does the length of the blind code on the shackle correlate to the age of the lock? For instance, did they only use certain series of blind codes in various time frames?

Thanks,
Joe

ElbowMacaroni

One more thing.

For the blind code 6129, I have determined two working combinations. One starting going right and one starting going left.

Reset the lock turning left and eventually to 0 after several complete rotations.

Starting with the dialing going right: R2-l10-R4-L7-R4-L2-R4
Starting with dialing left first: L8-R4-L7-R4-L2-R4

I had made a cutaway from this one since I have 7 more. But I figured I’d share so that people who have codebooks could make notes for this blind code.

-Joe