Information about Milner Safe

andreas

Hello,

I recently bougt an old Milner Safe.
It is still working properly but I couldnt find any information about it (age, condition etc…)

One key is original with the number “AD 606” on it.
On the outside upper right i can read “D 606”
On the inside upper right i think there is “712”, probably a letter before.

See attached related pictures.

I would be very glad if anybody had any information concerning this nice piece for me.

Thank you in advance and best regards

Andreas

safeman

Andreas, the safe serial number AD606 would have been made in 1918. Being the last year of World War 1 there were very few safes being made, in fact only 625 in total.
The stampings on the edge of the body will probably be the body makers mark and the weight of the safe as being
7 cwts. 1 quarter, and 2 lbs. if your figures are correct for a safe measuring 28″× 22″× 22″.

These show the original colours and door furniture for the same period.

Huw Eastwood

Welcome Andreas nice Milners you got there, great that you got an original key and makes a change to see one with round locking bolts post change from the earlier rectangular bolts.
You shouldn’t have too much trouble finding replacements for the missing brassware, most of it can be found easy enough online.

safeman

For example on Ebay today ref.311991015729

andreas

Hello safeman, hello huw,

thank you very much for your answers! I am very happy with this!

I cannot find the ebay item…i would be interested, is the number correct?

Thank you and best regards,

andreas

safeman

Andreas, Huw’s reply has reminded me that I didn’t quite you give the correct catalogue description of your safe.

It should have read Milner List 3 (Improved Patent) 1915, which covers the fact that this model has now been produced with a four-corner bent body instead of the square body, plus the introduction of round bolts as Huw mentions.

The greatest security improvement is that instead of the lockcase being bolted on to the back of the door, it now is formed of ‘T’ bars 3½"x 3½“x ½” rivetted to the door plate giving a !“ door edge thickness instead of the previous ½”. This gives much greater protection against the use of wedges and levers. (See attached).

andreas

Thank you very much so far…! I now found the ebay offer but unfortunately it wont be shipped to germany.

best regards

Andreas

Chubby

BTW that weight equates to 370 Kg.

Huw Eastwood

After offloading my safe plates a few years back I think I ended up with one of those left here somewhere. There’s a load of variations though so I’d have to check to be sure. Plus, you’re missing the door pull, backing rose, and all the brass screws so best to wait for another job lot to come up for sale like safeman posted, and get everything in one go.

Huw Eastwood

There’s also this variant Andreas, and possibly others as well, so you might need to measure between the centres of the fixing holes to determine which it is.

andreas

Hello experts,

i managed to buy the ebay items safeman recommended…(i will get them the new year when very far relatives from scotland will bring them along….)

I am playing with the idea of restaurating (more or less) my safe - myself.
Maybe you can give me some advice where to pay attention, whether I should give up now or how big my chance for an aceptable result is..
The following questions occur to me:

Can I unmount the door?
What about any replacement screws as there are some missing or some without head?
(I have the tools to put new threads but will it be possible with the material?)
What about opening the lock mechanism?
Is there any fill material in the walls and should I replace it and with what?

It would be no problem if this is going to be a longer project but i am only interested if i have got a realistic chance🙁sweat): or i should be happy as it is.

Thank you very much for your help and best regards

Andreas

Chubby

Can you unmount the door? well, anything is possible, but don’t!

Regarding the screws, yes you can tap out the holes to a modern thread size. That is my favoured option with all such safes, but I am vilified on the forum for it. I would do that and replace them with allen head screws of the correct type. Some of those old ones have sharp edges and can be truly horrible.

Filling? It is a mixture of alum crystals and hardwood sawdust. This gives some protection against fire but over the years it will have settled down leaving voids in the upper part of the safe. So the fire resistance is bound to be somewhat compromised.

Chubby

I forgot. es, you can open the lock mechanism and clean it. If you want it to work from the original key, number the levers- an ordinary pencil is as good as anything for that purpose. Make sure they go back in the correct order. Actually if there is some danger of someone else having a duplicate key (and there always is such a risk) then you should get a locksmith to rearrange the levers and cut a new key.

safeman

andreas wrote
Hello experts,

Can I unmount the door?
What about any replacement screws as there are some missing or some without head?
(I have the tools to put new threads but will it be possible with the material?)
What about opening the lock mechanism?
Is there any fill material in the walls and should I replace it and with what?

It would be no problem if this is going to be a longer project but i am only interested if i have got a realistic chance🙁sweat): or i should be happy as it is.

Thank you very much for your help and best regards

Andreas

You should have no problems restoring this safe especially now that you have some door furniture. Some of the fixing holes may not coincide bur the door plate is mild steel and can easily be redrilled and tapped.

To remove the fire-resisting chamber on the back of the lockcase should present few problems, especially if you lay the safe on it’s back first as some of the chamber screws underneath can be a bit of a problem. Some of the putty covering the screw heads is already missing and if any are partly broked they could always be used underneath where they won’t be seen. Clear the slot in the screwheads to ensure a clean grip with the screwdriver.

As for fire-resistance, if there is no sign of loose dust in the interior the composition will stiil be sound. It is not intended as much for insulation as for creating moisture when heated which permeates into the interior lowering the flash point of any documents.

[unknown]

Chubby

Sorry, when you mentioned unmounting the door I thought you meant removing it from the body. That can be done, but it would be a big and pointless job! Of course you will have to remove the back pan from the door.

As said, those screw heads were filled an often ground. They can have edges which will give you a nasty cut, which is why I would prefer to retap and use modern ones.

andreas

Hello to all,

finally after your very useful advice i got perfect brassware, put new threads in an got appropriate paint.
I am very happy with my new eye catcher as well as my family who were at first slightly irritated about this project.
Here you can see my result, how it was before see beginning of the thread.😃:

Best regards

Andreas

00247

Very nice. It is always good to see an old safe brought back to life. 🙁y):

Gary Stephenson

Ad606