Old Floor Safe- Help ID and have a few questions

southpawlou

Hi All,

First post and I’m glad I found this place. I recently moved into a new house and the former owner left behind this old floor safe. She said it was something her late husband brought home years ago. I would like to find out more about it and also need to know if this is something that can be cracked since the combination died with her husband. The drill is in the picture to show the scale of safe. Thanks in advance.

Chubby

I had held my hand, expecting some of the American technicians to answer first. As they haven’t I will start the ball rolling.

I can’t tell you what the safe is. Somebody else might be able to.

As it is a Sargent & Greenleaf combination wheel it is extremely probable that the lock is also an S & G. Without wishing to be disparaging to your safe, it is unlikely that it is anything more than any one of their 3 wheel models. Whilst a very good lock, offering a high degree of security, it is by no means invulnerable. Any good locksmith ought to be able to manipulate it open for you. That is probably the best way to go. If you do this you will then have a fully functioning safe and can change the combination to one of your own choice. Whilst there the locksmith would be able to clean and service the lock, and the boltwork etc. of the safe and probably tell you exactly what you have got.

The alternative would be to drill it open or cut it open. Of course if you do that there will be damage to the unit which would need to be repaired. Some insurance companies will never give you coverage on a safe that has been opened in this way.

One thing which I would urge on you is to do something! This can never be reiterated too many times. NEVER HAVE A SAFE IN YOUR HOME WHICH IS LOCKED CLOSED AND TO WHICH YOU CANNOT GET ACCESS! I hope it never happens but if you were to be burgled when you are actually at home, the miscreants are likely to ask you politely to open the safe. If you can’t they will assume that you are being stubborn and might well become progressively less polite in their requests. THIS DOES HAPPEN!

southpawlou

Excellant recommendation about doing something. That exact thing happened to a former co-worker. He left our company and went to work for another company as a manager. They had a safe at that location and he was not given the combo. One week into his new employment, they were robbed as he was closing up. The robber demanded he open the safe which he couldn’t do and he was shot dead. Two co-workers heard the whole thing from the room they were told to stay in. That was over 20 years ago, long forgotten until you triggered my memory. RIP Mark.

Thanks again.

David Hovey

To answer your question. Yes your safe can be “cracked”.

I classify your safe in what I call “cast iron”. It appears it was mfg. by York Safe Co. York’s of this era came with many different model Yale and S&G combination locks. The dial assembly is a retro fit from a more modern time, which leads to the question; Was the combination lock changed as well?

southpawlou

Hi All,

In a last chance effort, I reached out to the old owner of my house and asked again about the safe combo. To my surprise, she found it! She thought the combo was long gone but found it written on a small piece of paper. When she gave me the combo, there was two sets of numbers. I asked her why there was two combos and …well… I’ll let the pictures tell the story. If anyone can provide me with some insight about this. I’m all ears. Thanks!

00247

Now that is impressive.

The nondescript outside makes one want to yawn and pass it on by, but holy crap, open the door and and look out! It’s like Clark Kent transforming into Superman! I wish it was sitting between my cannonball and screw door safes.

Does it say anything on the knob of the inner dial? How about the round cover on the back of the door?

Thanks for the update.

Chubby

Very good.

What I like about that set up is what happens if there is an attack on the safe. You know the sort of stupid attack where someone thinks they can get in using a hammer. They are a nuisance because of the damage they do. You are much better having any such damage on the lighter door which can be fixed much more easily.

Huw Eastwood

What an unexpected find. What you have is a round door money chest that’s been retro-fitted in the old firesafe to give additional burglary protection. Glad it all worked out for you, being patient paid off by getting the combinations (against the odds) and of course zero damage to the safes, which makes everyone smile on here- happy days !

T Davison

The safe is a York with the dial replaced . The original dial would have been for a S&G
6828 lock body. The dial would be a chrome over brass. If the lock body is cast iron that the original lock.
The inside chest is a York 480 chest. The lock is a Yale 2421 3 wheel lock with 2 spring and 2 gravity loaded relocker.
TJ

00247

Looks like York did produce this model safe as another one turned up. Identical other than this one still has the original lock. Pretty cool in my book.

Huw Eastwood

Well I never….seeing that’s amazed me even more really, since but for the exception of both the dials matching on the second one, the styles of the outer safe and the the inner chest still look to be at least 50 years apart to me !

Nice unusual safe though- always good to have something a bit different.

southpawlou

Wow, nice to see another one. I figured for sure that this was a retrofit. Notice it has the same security rating tag. I guess that is the telltale.

Huw Eastwood

Well another big surprise in that they’ve actually showed up a few times in the past.
http://www.antique-locks.com/showthread.php/2708-Acme-Safe
If you search for York 400 Line on here you’ll find several other posts that discuss them.