Cash drop facility on safes. Insurance issue ??

Safeone

Sometime ago I was offered a couple of good quality safes from a major car showroom which was closing , one Chubb Trident and one Tann Fortress 2. The Chubb had a cash drop drum type of device on the top of the safe while the Tann had a kind of letter box item on its side ( this was for car keys to be dropped into at the close of day )

I found a buyer for both but he pulled out of the deal due to his insurance company knocking him down on overnight cover due to the ‘drop’ devices.

I ran this past the safe insurance guru Mike Palmer and his reply is below. Thought it maybe of interest to anyone considering buying this style of safe.

Hello Ian,

Interesting that you should ask this question as there is a bit of a storm raging at the moment over this particular subject. Questions were raised with AiS following a series of alleged raids on deposit safes in France They were fitted with pneumatic air tube conveyor systems and apparently the carrier capsules were removed by using a high powered vacuum cleaner. This lead on to the wider discussion about deposit traps fitted to safes tested and certified in accordance with EN1143-1.

Richard Flint of BRE commented as follows:

• EN1143-1 covers free-standing safes, ATM safes, strongrooms and strongroom doors.
• EN1143-2 covers deposit safes and night safes.

The design requirements relating to openings are quite clearly defined in EN1143-1:

4.2.1 Safes, strongroom doors and strongrooms
There shall be no holes through the protection material other than those necessary for locks, cables or anchoring, nor for the fitting of accessories to strongroom doors and strongrooms. Cable openings in safes, strongroom doors and strongrooms (with or without a door) shall not exceed 100 mm2.

Unused cable entry openings shall be obstructed or plugged by the manufacturer by a means of which cannot be removed from the outside without leaving visible traces. Free-standing safes with a mass of less than 1 000 kg shall have at least one hole by which they can be anchored.
The anchoring assembly for each anchoring hole shall sustain the force given in Table 1.

The simple answer is that any safe fitted with a deposit facility, must be tested and certified in accordance with EN1143-2. If a deposit facility is fitted to any safe tested to EN1143-1, the certification will be invalid. So far so good. If it hasn’t got EN1143-2 it can’t have the cash rating associated with its grade. If it has got EN1143-2 then the cash ratings are as usual for that grade of safe.

The problem arises when you discuss the cash ratings of those deposit safes where the certification is deemed invalid. Richard Flint says they should restricted to no more than £4,000 – the same as a Level S2 Safe Cabinet. This is where the storm is raging.

Unfortunately, the only answer I can give is that each safe must be considered individually. If asked, I am happy to give a personal view, but ultimately it is up to the insurer to decide by how much the cash rating should be reduced.

Best regards,

Mike Palmer FSyI

Huw Eastwood

It doesn’t surprise me to be honest Safeone, any form of deposit safe has always carried a lower rating than its non-deposit equivalent because of the inevitable weakness in the defensive structure.

Same applied way back pre the Euro gradings, and of course still applies today (perhaps even more so) under the EN 1143-1 and 2 categories.

The added problem these days is that sadly all of the ‘super’ safes we discuss on here like Chubb Sovereigns, Tann Treasury’s and SLS Gems etc were all made long before the European grading system came into effect, so despite their incredible levels of engineering and protection, they simply have never been tested to the modern Euro grades to see how they fare.

Where ratings and insurance cover are of essential importance and unavoidable then unfortunately it’s really a case of forget all the ‘golden oldie’ Chubb, Tann and SLSs as it’ll almost inevitably mean disappointment and necessitate a certified Euro grader to whatever rating is being specified. Yes, it’s always got to be worth asking but like the above letter shows, its often disappointing with the cover offered on what are essentially still fantastic safes.