Yooz Hi all, We have a couple of safes in our warehouse and I was hoping you guys might be able to help with dating and possibly valuing them as so far I’ve not been able to find much on them. First of all we have an E Hipkins & Co Dudley safe, there’s some scratching on the paintwork and the keyhole cover is missing (if it had one) but otherwise it’s in good condition, we have the key for the safe door but not the keys for the inside drawers sadly. From what I’ve found so far it’s maybe late 19th century, early 20th but not sure on decade. Second we have a smaller Withy Grove Stores safe, this one has had a bit of rusting and wear + tear on both inside and out but apart from the keys it doesn’t seem to be missing anything. This one seems a bit more recent as well but I’ve not been able to find much out on it. I’ve taken a few snaps of them and tried to get as much detail as possible, the photos are in the imgur album linked below; if you want to see anything else let me know and I’ll take more pics. Any light you can shed is much appreciated, thanks!
Chubby The old one is typical of tens of thousands of safes of that epoch. They are interesting curios but virtually worthless and woefully insecure. The one with the Withy Grove Stores Manchester one is much more modern as you astutely observe. The sticker means only that it was sold by WGS. Has there been a top lock removed? Or is that higher mounting a relocking device, I am not sure. It looks like a nice little unit. I particularly like the deposit facility with the tiger teeth. That is very unusual.
Huw Eastwood The second modern safe is an SMP- looks like a Salopian but might be the Economy model. Salopian has a slightly thicker door plate. Dudley also made very similar safes but the bolt throw mech was the identifying factor. Dudley used the old ‘scotch key’ to hold the cam on the back of the spindle, whereas SMP did it properly as on that one! Also Dudleys just welded the hard plate on, whereas that’s typical SMP with the hard plate under a mild steel ‘bridge’. That mechanism has been modified though- the top lock (which has been removed) should operate the live relocker, but that has been modified so that the bottom lock holds the relocker off the lock case- as a static non moving dead relocker. It would have to be reinstated back to live in order to sell it as it must have the live relocker working to meet its rating.
Yooz Thank you for the info Chubby & Max! The bits about the smaller safe are especially useful as I had found that WGS sell safes but was unsure if they manufactured also, hopefully now I can look at finding out more about the make. That’s a shame about the modifications to the mechanism, though I had always thought they would make interesting decorative pieces more than anything else. Anyway, thank you again for your insight as it is much appreciated!
Huw Eastwood Yes the more I look at it, definitely an SMP and convinced it’s a Salopian. The handle and style of the hinges are also classic SMP and right for that model. It’s a shame someone’s blocked the key way for the top lock though. Anyone’s guess as to what they’ve done- could be a welded plug or a tapered plug driven in, either way it’s messy. There should be a small rectangular aluminium plate on the top left back of the door- that would normally have the model and manufactured date marked on it. Also you can look at the centre locking bolt for any ID numbers stamped on the end. Weird about all these Hipkins safes suddenly popping up all over the place!
Huw Eastwood I’m out of sync on these replies Yooz- you must have been doing yours at the same time as me. Yeah no worries, SMP are still going at the Telford factory and they’ve made the Salopian for years. A few years now since I’ve done work for them so not sure if they still make it, but wouldn’t be surprised if they do.
Safeone Drove down Withy Grove in Manchester just the other day and the showroom, term used very lightly, is still there with many safes etc strewn willy nilly. Never really changed much that place. It has always looked like it is in the last week of trading.
Russell Stoner I run the Withy Grove in Leeds, and thank goodness we do not look like we are closing!!!! The more modern safe you have is indeed an SMP. It’s NOT a Salopian, but is indeed the Brittannia. Heavy beasty as well. It has been worked on hence a rather unusual lock throw bar. My guess is the top lock. broke and the smithy couldn’t find a replacement so he fitted the lock as is now and he didn’t want to cut a bolt mortise to the mech!! The oldie is quite tidy for its age. C 1920-1927 is about as close as I’ll throw in the ring. Need more info, be my guest and look me up. Regards Russell Safeone wroteDrove down Withy Grove in Manchester just the other day and the showroom, term used very lightly, is still there with many safes etc strewn willy nilly. Never really changed much that place. It has always looked like it is in the last week of trading. [unknown]
Yooz Thanks Russell for explaining the work on the SMP safe a bit more, I thought the old Hipkins might be from around the 1920s due to the design on the front door so it’s good to have a closer estimate.
