Chubb double-door vault

wylk

Here’s something unusual (and contemporary) –

Aside from the unusual rectangular bolts (most safes/vaults use cylindrical bolts), I wonder why there are two doors. I came up with two possibilities so far.

1 - Building entrances and other doorways sometimes use two doors with a removable center piece (stile?) to allow passage of large objects. But this framework looks solid, so that’s not the case here.

2 - In older times there was a worry that if the main door fails to open, business would be severly impacted because customers cannot get to their boxes. But in the past an emergency door was added which was much smaller and less expensive. A full-size second door was rather rare, and such concerns went out of style a long time ago.

Any other ideas? Is this unusual?

This is Heathrow Safe Deposit Limited (http://www.heathrowsafedeposit.com), 113a The Broadway, Southall, Middlesex (London).

Huw Eastwood

Guessing it’s probably #2 wylk- it’d be unthinkable to even consider a removable central style on a vault of that caliber.

Yes, the use of smaller emergency doors seems to have diminished in recent years, but where they have got the sense to incorporate one, it makes far more sense to make the second door full size so it can be used as normal by staff and customers, and not like the old days where using one meant a 6 month diet to slim down and crawl through it.

Both doors are side by side leading to the same immediate area, so the doors could be used on an alternated system of days or weeks keeping both in working order and either one acting as the emergency.

Regarding the rectangular bolts, quite a few european manufacturers have been using them for some time now- notably German makers spring to mind.

I’m guessing again here but think this is probably the reason- rectangular bolts can be cut far more cost effectively from heavy steel plate or sheet by the same automated machines (CNC Laser, water-jet, plasma etc) that are being used for cutting of the door and body anyway. Overall it saves time and costs as it eliminates round stock being turned on CNC lathes, drilling, tapping threads, additional welding etc. I think it’s all that competitive out there these days that they have to save and slash wherever they can and we’ll probably see more such changes in the future.

The days of properly ‘engineered’ safes with turned bronze bushings and precision fits are long gone- running fits from laser cut parts are as good as they seem to get these days!

Huw Eastwood

Just thought of another link there with the rectangular bolts- those modern Chubb doors look similar to Fichet’s range-think Fichets are called Opptura. They’ve used rectangular bolts for some time now.

With both being under the Gunnebo group there’s yet more costs cut and savings evident as multiple brands are coming from the same production facilities. They probably get wheeled out onto the warehouse floor with a tag hanging on them telling the bloke whether to fit a Chubb, fichet, Rosengrens badge etc!

Paul Prescott

The doors are actually built in one of the Gunnebo groups factorys in germany (Liecher ???).

The far east factory cannot produce quality SRD.

The lockers are clearly Rosengrens.

wylk

Here are a couple of Fichet Optema images showing rectangular bolts.

wylk

One of the very few US rectangular-bolt makers was Hibbard-Rodman-Ely (roughly 1899 to 1909).

safeman

wylk wrote
Here’s something unusual (and contemporary) –

[ATTACH=CONFIG]12977[/ATTACH]

Aside from the unusual rectangular bolts (most safes/vaults use cylindrical bolts), I wonder why there are two doors. I came up with two possibilities so far.

1 - Building entrances and other doorways sometimes use two doors with a removable center piece (stile?) to allow passage of large objects. But this framework looks solid, so that’s not the case here.

2 - In older times there was a worry that if the main door fails to open, business would be severly impacted because customers cannot get to their boxes. But in the past an emergency door was added which was much smaller and less expensive. A full-size second door was rather rare, and such concerns went out of style a long time ago.

Any other ideas? Is this unusual?

This is Heathrow Safe Deposit Limited (http://www.heathrowsafedeposit.com), 113a The Broadway, Southall, Middlesex (London).

Sometimes it is a requirement to allow the free passage of visitors in and out
as in the Jewel House at the Tower of London.

[unknown]

wylk

Notice, also, one of the Jewel House doors has an opening handle on the inside, presumably in case somebody gets locked in. Not something you’d find on a bank door.

Huw Eastwood

Will have to get back and see those new ones in the Tower. It was a big surprise when they put those Tanns in place of the old Chubbs, but i know it was more down to visitor flow and control more than replacing the actual doors. New layout does look far better.

The one that always amazed me though was the Jewel House in Edinburgh Castle housing the Scottish Jewels- going back 15 or 20 years so they may have been changed also by now, but they were old Chubbs and one of them actually opened INWARDS! had to look twice to check I wasn’t imagining it. Very plain doors from memory but the only SRD I’ve ever seen that opens in.

Paul Prescott

wylk wrote
Notice, also, one of the Jewel House doors has an opening handle on the inside, presumably in case somebody gets locked in. Not something you’d find on a bank door.

I don’t think those main doors open from the outside at all. There is probably a third door somewhere unseen that does.

[unknown]

safeman

wylk wrote
Notice, also, one of the Jewel House doors has an opening handle on the inside, presumably in case somebody gets locked in. Not something you’d find on a bank door.

Although not fitted as standard to Strong Room doors in this country, internal release mechanisms are very common.

As mains electricity is generally not connected inside strongrooms except during working hours and then by armoured cable
through the door opening or by hinge switches, any person accidentally locked within a room should have a visible temporary
source of light available in order to read the printed instructions for disconnecting the locking mechanisms and releasing the
door.

Interestingly, during the height of daylight bank robberies in the 1970s, customers were sometimes forced into the bank strong-
rooms or book-rooms and the door closed and bolted. As a result an Anti-Herding device was developed which many banks fitted
to their doors which prevented the door from being fully closed in such circumstances.

As for the large spoked handles fitted to the back of the doors at the Tower, I feel they may be mainly cosmetic as a re-assurance to the public.

[unknown]

Paul Prescott

In the case of the tower I’m fairly sure (it’s a few years since I was last there and stole a sideways glance at the face of the door) that there are no handles / locks on the outside of the doors. And there are a pair of escutcheons above the handles on the inside …..

Huw Eastwood

that’s the thing with applications like these- especially jewel houses or museums where there is a public route for viewing- breeds some wacky and unusual set-ups. I did have a security magazine article on the new Tower installation from the 90s, I’ll see if I can find it although I doubt it’ll give much away in terms of layout or configuration of the doors.

Paul Prescott

If your thinking of the Keyways article I don’t recall it giving any details either.

Huw Eastwood

Now you’ve reminded me of the keyways one I’d forgotten about that. No, this was one of the freebie Euro security mags they used to send- had the usual picture of the doors open with a Beefeater stood in the middle and an accompanying article outlining the reasons for the changes and how they met the needs. Still can’t find it though…

Huw Eastwood

Just remembered these Rosengrens doors and thought it’s worth adding on here with the rectangular bolts theme.

I mentioned that a few European manufacturers had reverted back to using rectangular locking bolts for some time.

Fichet use them on both their Optema and Heavier Optura ranges, Robur of Sweden have used them for some time, likewise Wertheim of Austria, and also Stacke of Germany. Stacke it seems are one of the few manufacturers to make an EN1143 door to grade XIII. Many of even the big names stop at XI or XII, while plenty only build to grade X.

These now super-ceded Rosengrens RV2500 doors add yet another unusual twist having both round and rectangular bolts..

Huw Eastwood

Thanks Brian

I noticed you were on the post and then as if by magic the photo appeared. I don’t know which of these niggles are down to the iPad and which aren’t now!

wylk

Here is another example of a double-door vault. This one is in Costa Rica and houses the Pre-Columbian Gold Museum. But it’s so plain I have no idea who made it.