Donmetal vault doors

wylk · 2013-01-27T17:46:16+00:00

From roughly 1921 to 1930 Mosler marketed a vault door construction they called Donsteel (or, sometimes, Donmetal). The door was a sandwich of steel with a copper layer that would draw away the heat of a cutting torch, making it an ineffective tool. This was briefly discussed in another thread (“Old NYC banks get a new life”) but I thought I’d start a new thread since Donsteel was just a tangent to the original thread. I ran across a 1949 advertisement for Conoco motor oil that references Donsteel, but not by name, as an analogy to the extra protection of their oil. It seems strange since Mosler hadn’t been marketing Donsteel for nearly twenty years but somebody in Conoco’s advertising department must have been impressed by the idea. Maybe he was an old safecracker. Here is the image from eBay of the ad (the eBay item ID is 230750362144 though it is about to expire), plus an example door at the Courtyard/Marriott in San Diego.

Adrian Weber

Forgot one in the hurry.

Arcade Al

That’s a very odd advert! As hard as I try, I am still finding the parallels they are trying to make are extremely tenuous…

:^):

wylk

I visited the Kansas City Public Library and was able to examine their Donsteel door made in 1925. An important discovery, as I suspected, is that the copper layer is really just a decorative band. Tapping on it yielded a hollow “tink” kind of sound while the surrounding steel sounded very solid. The area under the band was likely cast with a depression (because Donsteel was “unmachineable” at the time and grinding was the only option and time-consuming, except around the edge of the band). So it does seem the copper was just a sort of trademark and maybe even intentionally misleading.

wylk

Here is an interesting advertisement from Bethlehem Steel that clearly shows what looks like a Donsteel door based on the copper strips. But we know Donsteel was only marketed from 1921 to 1930, while this ad supposedly dates to 1960 (according to the eBay seller) and shows what I believe is a Century door which was introduced in 1953.

So now we know that a copper strip does not necessarily mean a Donsteel door! Darn!

I also found it interesting that in 1960 the doors were built up by welding plates together. In older times I believe they were cast in a single piece.

wylk

I stumbled upon an actual item with the name Donmetal, the first mention I’ve found aside from the Mosler history. It’s a paperweight. These images are from an eBay auction; I don’t own this.

jgriner

wylk wrote
Here is an interesting advertisement from Bethlehem Steel that clearly shows what looks like a Donsteel door based on the copper strips. But we know Donsteel was only marketed from 1921 to 1930, while this ad supposedly dates to 1960 (according to the eBay seller) and shows what I believe is a Century door which was introduced in 1953.

So now we know that a copper strip does not necessarily mean a Donsteel door! Darn!

I also found it interesting that in 1960 the doors were built up by welding plates together. In older times I believe they were cast in a single piece.

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the usbank in benton ky, has the same door minus the copper bands, but i think the door is diebold. Could be wrong

btw: wylk where are you from?

[unknown]

wylk

Another Donsteel door, more noteworthy here because of the unusual re-use of the bank building.

Houston, TX: 202 Main Street, former Houston National Bank (1928, http://www.emporis.com/building/islamicdawahcenter-houston-tx-usa) now an Islamic Center (http://www.islamicdawahcenter.org/html/history.html, http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/06/realestate/commercial/06houston.html?_r=3&oref=slogin&oref=slogin&, http://ifyokoye.com/2009/08/17/visit-to-hakeem-olajuwons-masjid). The original entrance appears to have been 202 Main Street (corner of Main and Franklin) but the Islamic Center’s entrance is 201 Travis Street which was the bank’s back entrance off the parking lot. Sadly, the round Mosler Donmetal door has been painted white; another door is said to be the entrance to the women’s restroom.

wylk

Another Donsteel door, nicely photographed and possibly still in use.

Washington, PA: 30 East Beau Street (or 6 South Main Street), former Washington Trust Company (http://www.emporis.com/building/washingtontrustbuilding-washington-pa-usa), now a WesBanco branch (http://www.wesbanco.com). Built in 1902 (http://www.observer-reporter.com/article/20121221/NEWS01/121229841#.Us2nhOtCZxA) though this Mosler Donsteel door would date from the 1920s, possibly in the annex constructed in 1920 along Shaefer Avenue. In November of 2013 the building was purchased with the intent of converting it to apartments and commercial units (http://www.observer-reporter.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20140108/NEWS01/140109404). Imagery is from http://brook-ward.com.

wylk

Regarding the Washington Trust door (previous post), I noticed at the top of the frame there is a block of three apparent electrical contacts, plus what looks like a push-button switch in a neighboring bolt hole. And that the boltwork is the “offset” style, rotated from the slightly more common north-south-east-west (or 12-3-6-9 o’clock) arrangement.

Chubby

It is interesting what you say. When I was young there were 2 real competitors in the field in UK- Chubb and Tann. They had different philosophies.

Chubb produced an extremely hard and almost impenetrable material which they used as a single solid piece. Tann used to layer a variety of materials each with a particular quality.

Of course each claimed their material to be superior. In practice I wonder how much difference there actually was in resistance to attack.

One amusing incident was when I spoke to a Tann representative. He said Chubb were “using technology we scrapped decades ago”. A Chubb representative defending the particular technology said “They tried to introduce it years ago but never really got it to work properly”.

I also found it interesting that in 1960 the doors were built up by welding plates together. In older times I believe they were cast in a single piece.

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Chubby

How much copper is needed to achieve the effect?

wylk

Chubby wrote
How much copper is needed to achieve the effect?

None, actually. Mosler added thin copper bands merely as decoration when they started marketing Donsteel. Whether it originated with Mosler or not, the legend sprang up that an actual copper layer was sandwiched between steel layers with the effect of thwarting torch attacks by conducting heat away faster than the torch could heat things up. There is no mention of a copper layer in patents, and no mention in a paper Mosler published on Donsteel. Also no mention that I can find in period trade journals or news reports. I also had a chance to tap on the copper band of an actual Donsteel door (Kansas City Public Library) and it was distinctly hollow.

Mosler continued to sell doors with a copper band (or two bands) even after they discontinued Donsteel. Think of it as a sort of trademark. I’m sure they were glad of the legend, as were their customers; it may have deterred a burglary attack here and there.

[unknown]

wylk

Based on recent discoveries (see http://www.antique-locks.com/showthread.php/3281-Old-Mosler-Bank-Vault-Scrap-or-Value) I need to reverse my stand on Donsteel doors! Lack of evidence caused me to conclude that Mosler did not use copper in the door, and that the visible stripe was just a decorative trim. Wrong! Now that the insides of a door have been exposed it is clear that copper was poured into spaces in the door and that this works very well at thwarting torch attacks. The visible copper strip is indeed decorative.

What about the non-Donsteel doors (after about 1930) with a copper trim? I suppose the door is made from a more conventional steel alloy rather than Donsteel, but Mosler may have continued offering copper-filled doors.

Exactly how the interior space (for the copper) was designed is still unknown. A good assumption would be that these are not simple flat-faced sandwiches. The front and back at least need protrusions into the copper to hold it all firmly together. The steel faces may even have been joined with integral-cast “pillars” leaving voids for the copper.

While I was clearly wrong, I’m glad to see that Mosler built such tough doors that live up to legend.

Huw Eastwood

Wylk there’s the same subject on the two different threads going on here! That’s pretty much what I mentioned over on the recent ‘old Mosler bank vault’ thread:

“I think they might have a bit of fun dealing with that copper layer as its not just about the thermal conduction of the copper itself, but also surface area for maximum heat transfer. Like the cooling fins on an engine head allowing maximum convection to the surrounding air, it’s the same here but for conduction through the metals instead. I’d be amazed if it’s just a smooth sided slab of copper, got a feeling it’ll be interlocked at least to the outer door slab if not the the sides as well, which might mean more comedy entertainment when they can’t cut it or get it out…”

Doug MacQueen

At this point, it would be interesting to put an oxygen lance on that door. IIRC Mosler claimed it would hold up against it.

Billy B Edwards Jr. CML

Doug MacQueen wrote
At this point, it would be interesting to put an oxygen lance on that door. IIRC Mosler claimed it would hold up against it.

A friend ran across this description of Donsteel, supposedly from the 1999 official Mosler history:

“Donsteel” frustrated burglars
“Donsteel” and “Donmetal”, named after the Mosler sales manager of that time, J.G. Donaldson, were special metal alloys that had tremendous resistance to drills and torches. The alloys were used in the construction of vault doors, lock housings, and some money safes. A famous test of Donsteel’s resistance to torches was conducted on October 14, 1924 at the Hamilton plant and witnessed by many prominent citizens, law enforcement officials, bankers and the press. Test technicians used an oxygen lance, five tanks of oxygen and 45 feet of pipe in an attempt to penetrate a two inch thick plate of Donsteel. After the test, witnesses testified that:

“There was not even a blister on the surface thereof.”

Mosler organized the Guardian Metal Products Company in 1921 to manufacture Donsteel. A building with a 10,000 lb. traveling crane was built at the south end of Building No. 8 in which high-temperature electric furnaces were installed. However, the sale of Donsteel and Donmetal products did not meet volume expectations and the equipment was sold in 1930. The space was needed to heat-treat small money safes which were then very popular with gasoline stations and chain stores.

BBE.

[unknown]

wylk

BBE wrote
A friend ran across this description of Donsteel, supposedly from the 1999 official Mosler history:

That was posted in this thread back on January 28, 2013.

[unknown]

Billy B Edwards Jr. CML

wylk wrote
That was posted in this thread back on January 28, 2013.

Sorry, missed it.
BBE.

[unknown]

wylk

A current eBay auction (https://www.ebay.com/itm/253528253113) has answered the question of how much copper goes into a door. The auction is for a 1948 bid by Mosler for Federal Reserve bank vault doors (for Seattle and Portland). One of the diagrams shows it’s quite a lot:

A short discussion appears earlier in the bid:

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