York Ely-Norris cannonball safe with pie timelock

vlad0002

Just wanted to share some pictures of my ‘new’ Ely-Norris cannonball safe. I have extaracted it from a banks vault in nothern Iowa. The name of the bank is on the safe. Everything is original and complete, all the timelock keys are there. Timelock functions great. Finish is very well preserved. However, from temperature/humidity fluctuations in the vault, the finish underlayer got loose, causing the paint to crack, ‘breathe’ and chip off easily. To remedy this problem I’ve sprayed several coats of Krylon triple-thick glaze. This helped a lot – finish now stays put, but not sure for how long. Because the safe is so nicely preserved overall, I was thinking of not refinishing it. Instead I would like to patch up the areas where the finish is gone. Any pointers here? One guy told me that a color-matched epoxy might do the trick.

Also, any kind of info about this type of safe will be highly appreciated. Like an old catalog, maybe? What might be a value of such safe in the condition shown? The safe is ₄₅ inches high, weights ₃,000 lbs. I saw this timelock alone going for ~$1000 on eBay not long ago…

Thanks again.

vlad0002

More pictures…

Paul Prescott

Another fine safe !

The timelocks do make good money, although they are not as scarce as the pin dial on your other safe still a very nice lock to have.

A point just FYI should anyone ever be offered one of these that is ‘locked’. The actual main security of this design is solely in the timelock. The combination lock is only a ‘day lock’ and can be defeated quite easily. So as long as the timelock is open / the door not rusted shut this model is not hard to open.

vlad0002

Thank you very much for your input, oldlock. That’s good to know, about the locked cannonballs.

I am keeping my eyes open for a Corliss, but heard even the smalest ones are still big and increadibly heavy… Plus most of them are on the east coast, as they were produced in Rhode Island. Heard of only one spoted here, in Midwest.

Vlad

Paul Prescott

Just to clarify - it’s only this model, with this particular timelock configuration that has this issue when opening ..

wylk

Some time ago I found this image of an advertisement for Ely-Norris safes inside York safes. It is supposedly from 1918 and shows the working relationship that Ely-Norris had with York at the time. What I also find interesting is that the ad mis-spells the name of the company, at the bottom, as “Eli-Norris”.

The image is from http://www.officemuseum.com/filing_equipment_safes.htm and in particular http://www.officemuseum.com/1918_York_Safe_and_Lock_Co_York_PA.jpg.

jmosler

I have this same safe. It’s open but the dial is too stiff to turn. I need to remove the dial and face plate. Does anyone have any good ideas?

Matts

Great safe…and thank you for posting the pictures of the original striping. Here is an Ely-Norris I restored a while back. Doug did the time lock work on it.

Matt
Nahum 1:7

Matts

These were called “fire jacketed” cannonball safes…here is a photo of Mosler’s version of one I recently restored.

Matt
Nahum 1:7

wylk wrote
Some time ago I found this image of an advertisement for Ely-Norris safes inside York safes. It is supposedly from 1918 and shows the working relationship that Ely-Norris had with York at the time. What I also find interesting is that the ad mis-spells the name of the company, at the bottom, as “Eli-Norris”.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]8819[/ATTACH]

The image is from http://www.officemuseum.com/filing_equipment_safes.htm and in particular http://www.officemuseum.com/1918_York_Safe_and_Lock_Co_York_PA.jpg.

[unknown]

Texaschilli

I just purchased and now have an Ely Norris cannonball safe. It has Yale? triple timelocks and Yale dual combination lock on the outside of the door.

I know nothing about how to go about cleaning the safe up to repaint it. The timelock works and I have a change key to reset combinations for the outside locks that are set on “50”.

Could anyone give me some pointer on restoring a cannonball? Can I take the door off to get the body sandblasted or beadblasted? Or at least take out the timelock so it does not get broken? Is that difficult?

Thanks

Doug MacQueen

First off, do you consider yourself a pretty good mechanic? If not, then let someone else do this work. Second, I would not rush into doing anything at all until you have first become familiar with how it all works. And I mean very familiar. After doing this, then you should wind up the timelock movements and the mainspring to test operation with the door open. One thing you don’t want to do is to wind up the automatic time lock and close the door. There is info on this forum and possibly some elsewhere. Once you have done some in depth research, then you should start asking specific questions you may have concerning the timelock or the double dial lock. Then when you do start tearing it apart, you will be ahead of the game, instead of behind the 8 ball. And post some pictures because many here would like to see it, myself included. Doug

1977Vega

Hello, new to the forum. I just purchased a cannonball safe and I don’t have to combo for it. It’s a single dial safe, triple clocks on the back of the door. What do you have to do to get to the wheel pack to find the combo? I need to some guidance to achieving this. Thanks, Eric

Doug MacQueen

The comb lock mounted on the front plate was for use as a day lock. IIRC the plate will not come off until the comb bolt is retracted. So your choices are pretty much manipulation or drilling. Given the fact that you are obviously not skilled in either method otherwise you wouldn’t be asking, I would recommend hiring out the job. Have fun with the safe. However do not , I repeat do not close the door just to see how the timelock automatic works. That’s how lockouts occur.

1977Vega

Thanks for the info Doug, it was obviously useless to my question. If I recall, I didn’t say anything about trying to take the front plate off the safe to expose the day lock. I’m looking for tip about getting to that wheel pack. I had the spring pack off and was playing with the gear to make the bolts throw. Obviously, put it back on to prevent “lock out”. The dial is tough so I don’t want to fidget with it too much and then be stuck. I guess if all else fails, Jeff Sitar lives about and hour and a half from me. I could just hire him, but that would take the fun out of it. Eric

Doug MacQueen

I guess I don’t understand your question since the only wheel pack on that door is inside the day lock.

1977Vega

Doug, I’m looking for what to do and what not to do. I want to know how extensive it is to take the door apart from the back, is it worth messing with? I really bought the safe to display with the intentions of possible restoration down the road, but it would be nice to be able to use it as designed. As you know, there isn’t a ton of info on these safes or video via YouTube. You are correct, I’m not a locksmith by trade but am mechanically inclined. I’m not interested in having a locksmith drill it and scope it either, it’ll just stay locked open. Any feedback is appreciated, Eric

Huw Eastwood

1977Vega wrote
Thanks for the info Doug, it was obviously useless to my question. If I recall, I didn’t say anything about trying to take the front plate off the safe to expose the day lock…

To be honest I had to read that a few times in order to believe I was reading it, perhaps not the best of ways to encourage Doug to give of his time and knowledge to answer in detail- or any members for that matter- good luck with it.

[unknown]

1977Vega

Given the fact that you are obviously not skilled in either method otherwise you wouldn’t be asking,

Doesnt sound like the warmest encouragement either.

Doug MacQueen

Well I wasn’ t trying be rude, only emphasizing the point of hiring someone with the skills. However, I see now that I did answer your question in your original post and you didn’t even know it. It seems you are under the impression that you can reach the outer door lock through the rear of the door, which you cannot do as there is no access to the front. So it pays to be a little more tolerant it determining intent when you are ignorant on a subject.

1977Vega

Ignorant to the subject, sure. But aren’t we all at some point in time? That’s the reason for joining a forum board, to talk to people who have learned a thing or two because they were once “ignorant to the subject”. So Doug, you’re saying they’re is no mechanical way to the that day lock? Drilling or manipulation is the only methods?