Mosler Safe

Timothy

Try to get information on Mosler model KL-749 and model SCC-1215 if have in pdf. Not sure if these are the right one but i do recall in order to change combination have to add or subtract the number that was use. Example 50-25-50 add 60-35-60 to put in change key or 50-25-50 subtract 40-15-40….Tim….

Doug MacQueen

Not familiar with the numbers but have had a fair amount of experience with various Mosler products. Post some pictures.

Cepasaccus

Timothy, that depends on the lock. If there is an MRK-302 installed, than you need to add 10.5, i.e. if the combination is 50-25-50 you need to dial 60.5-35.5-60.5.

wylk

I’m trying to better understand what’s going on here. It sounds like these locks are key change, but the dial ring does not have a change mark, and they are not zero-change locks? If so, why would they have been installed with the “wrong” ring?

Cepasaccus

As you did not provide much about your Mosler I can give you only generic answers.

1) It is not a key change lock and the dial ring is the correct one.

2) It is a key change lock where both indices are the same and the dial ring is the correct one. In Germany all of the big Kromer locks had wheel 1 with a lever pushing out of the gate when the locking mechanism was released. There was also a S&G 6770 which was a 6730 with an additional metal sheet that lifted the lever by interacting with the change key.

3) There were key changeable locks which would have needed a change index, but the manufacturer might have not provided one. There are old instructions, which hat these offsets for dials without change index.

4) The lock might have been changed without the dial or just parts of the lock had been changed. The Mosler 302s required only the replacement of the back cover with the wheel pack to change the changing method, but I think all dial rings for the 302 (402) had the change index.

Timothy

Sorry took long enough to get back. This was not one of my job to do this work. It was a friend as locksmith and safe Yes is it still 302-402 Mosler combination Lock. I’m sure you all know that do need have open index and change index to change combination number. This 302-402 doesn’t have the change index but it does have change key hole on back. IN order to change combination as example if combination it 83-23-47 to open the lock now need to change combination much add 10 to the number. The combination it 83-23-47 add 10 should be 93-33-57. Now ready to get it change by using the open index 93-33-57 than put the change key in the change key hole. Leave the change key in to change to new combination number if 79-26-49 much add the number first to 89-36-59 on the opening index after change the number now take the change key out and try the new combination as 79-26-49 should open the lock. This is why trying to find a pdf on this 302-402 lock as don’t find it anywhere so far…..Hoping explain this better but not very good writing this out….Tim….

Timothy

By the way asking for picture they use these on all GSA Supplementary Control Container There are three model container with Mosler lock as far i know but the some of these Mosler lock are new and differ than the one i knew to do. There number are KL-749, SC-1612 and KC-1612.
Per attachment this is 302 does have Change index and the one i’m talking about doesn’t have the change index but using the open index…Tim….

mosler-302-operating-instructions.pdf

352kB

Cepasaccus

I have three MR-302s, i.e. all of them are mesh change. One is from a GSA Class 6 field safe. Newest patent 1980, black lock body, silver dial ring WITH change index. The second one is probably from a GSA Class 6 container, which got a lock upgrade. Newest patent 1985, black lock body, black dial ring WITH change index. The third one is from an unknown safe. It has a slightly longer spindle, so I don’t think it was a GSA container. That has newest patent date 1963, a silver body, silver dial ring WITHOUT change index. So maybe Mosler started in the 60s with mesh change locks that did not have a change key and then they started to offer MRK-302s with change index and there was some intermediate mix-up? So what color does the body and dial ring of your lock have?

I never heard about Supplementary Control Containers before your post and I have not found much online about them. Very interesting.

And I rechecked. The offset of the change index is indeed 10 on both rings, not 10.5.

Doug MacQueen

I looked through about 20 of my Mosler dial rings and only about a ⅓ of them have the change mark. This is also in line with my past experience on hundreds of Mosler 302-402 locks. I seem to also remember that having the side change mark did not even guarantee a key change model. Also Mosler MR lock models were also widely used on commercial burglary chests and not just by the military.

Timothy

OK! friend of my finally send me picture of lock. As you will notice only have opening index on the dial ring. I’m sure they have change the dial ring and dial so many time and as what year it was made i have no idea as it is hard to find information on this 302-402….Tim….

Cepasaccus

I am sure this dial is not a Mosler dial. I don’t know how they got a matching dial, because the spindle threading of the 302 is quite unusual. The last patent number on the lock cover is from 1985.

Doug MacQueen

I wouldn’t be to sure about that not being a Mosler dial. Yes unusual to be found with a Gr. 1R lock, but it does look familiar. Mosler made a ton of different products over their 125 + year run.

Cepasaccus

Doug MacQueen wrote
Mosler made a ton of different products over their 125 + year run.

You might be right.

[unknown]

Timothy

Doug was right as Mosler have made ton of differ lock. Just by look at any Mosler dial would be hard to tell What the inside combination lock it. All i know they have change there lock so many time it hard to tell. This is why some of the old safe in past would be hard to get information on these lock.
Yes is it Mosler dial ring as can still buy them today. I don’t remember who took over Mosler Lock Company ….Tim…..

Doug MacQueen

I went through some of my pics of Mosler and did find one small square door with that same dial and ring. But I would be absolutely amazed if you could get one from Diebold. Heck getting older Diebold stuff from Diebold can be a challenge.

Timothy

Yes do know that Diebold almost like the Mosler dial ring Also there replacement part call Big Red for the Mosler 302-402 per attachment….Tim…

20130813-big-red-catalog-group-2-2m-mech-safe-locks-dials.pdf

781kB

Keith Kolander

Sorry to drag up an old thread, but it pretty much sums up and goes along with the problem/question I have. My 302-402 doesn’t have the change index but it does have change key hole on back. The current combination is set to 50-25-50 to open the lock now. Say I want to change the combination to 53-13-30. If I am understanding the instructions correctly to do that I need to dial in 60-35-60(adding 10 to the current combination). Put in the change key and then dial in the new combination I want to use (53-13-30) take out the change key and try the new combination. Or am I misunderstanding a step or doing something wrong?

Cepasaccus

Hi Keith, That dial does not at all look like it belongs to a MRK-302. Everything in the change is relative to the missing change index. In don’t have a MRK, but I have a dial that probably came from one. The change index is about 9.5 numbers left. Maybe your 10 numbers are ok though. So add 10 or 9.5 to the current combo and dial it in. If the change key fits then your are on track. Turn the change key and dial the new combo with the same offset added. Turn the change key back and remove it. Don’t forget to test the new combo at least three times before closing the door.

Keith Kolander

Thanks for your help, got the combination changed on the first try. The lock is installed on an old TEL KEE key cabinet. The dial does not turn very smoothly I think the lock needs some cleaning and maintenance, any suggestions or tutorials for doing that?